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PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 11:12 am 
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Joined: Tue Oct 23, 2007 2:26 pm
Posts: 9
I've expressed the desire to use ZFS (via FUSE under Gentoo) with my next Kuro. I realized that most people here have probably never heard of ZFS or if they have probably suffer from some misconceptions. For a good intro please see Tom Yager's post at:

http://weblog.infoworld.com/yager/archives/2007/10/suns_zfs_is_clo.html

While I appreciate the kuro isn't the ideal box for stringing lots of JBODs together, the Pro DOES have two SATA interfaces and making one into eSATA is merely the matter of the correct cable, and there are USB ports. While not ideal, ZFS doesn't care what the underlying hardware is, if it's visable as a file, it can be part of a pool, which includes USB. ZFS solves the silent data corruption problem (which I've had with my Kuro and several other boxen) and is rediculously easy to use. Seriously, if you can log into the command line prompt and understand what device files are and know how you want to merge or divide up your disks, you'll be using it in a manner of minutes and you'll spend more time unlearning old habits. ZFS doesn't care if the devices are radically different or even different sizes for mirroring and RaidZ protection, although you may want to create equal size partitions and use the leftovers in order to not waste space.

I'd love some of the other features of OpenSolaris, combined with Portage on a Kuro, but that requires a level of effort *WAY* beyond my means. Hmmm, FreeBSD has a kernel native port of ZFS and Portage is available, has anyone tried FreeBSD on a Kuro yet?

So, why use ZFS with a Kuro? Because of all the reasons I want to use a Kuro anyway: low power and compact size chief among them. The dirty thought is that I could also probably get two SATA 2.5" drives INSIDE the chassis with a little bracket work...

Of course I want the rootfs in flash so I can use the whole disks for ZFS, but that presumes I can ever order a Kurobox Pro and get it delivered... :roll:

James


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 7:32 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jun 07, 2007 11:42 am
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Lots of us know what ZFS is, I wish there weren't so many issues with regards to licensing so that it could make it into the linux kernel. Nonetheless at present there is not reliable support for FUSE on a KuroPro running linux. I'm sure it will be there soon (I am waiting for it too).

I don't think anyone, including on the japanese side has managed to port a BSD variant to the Pro (ARM9), but I know Eiji has NetBSD for the HG
http://www5.atwiki.jp/kuro-bsd/


In the meantime if you cannot wait, I'd reccomend using a KuroHG for this purpose, but I think ZFS via FUSE would be painfully slow


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 8:47 pm 
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Joined: Thu Aug 09, 2007 4:49 pm
Posts: 13
I wold love to put OpenBSD on my KuroPro. If only I knew more about hacking. (It may actually be the easiest to port as they have an ARM variant kicking about.)


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 9:30 pm 
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Joined: Sat Jul 15, 2006 8:49 am
Posts: 219
Location: Virginia
You got me curious and since my test box (kuro HG) had a spare partition I thought I would try it and do some of the simple tests we did for XFS and JFS in this thread. Emerging following these directions, everything was going fine, but then:
Code:
>>> Compiling source in /var/tmp/portage/sys-fs/zfs-fuse-0.4.0_beta1-r1/work/zfs-fuse-0.4.0_beta1/src ...
scons: Reading SConscript files ...

Sorry, only the x86 and amd64 hardware architectures are supported
 *
 * ERROR: sys-fs/zfs-fuse-0.4.0_beta1-r1 failed.
 * Call stack:
 *   ebuild.sh, line 1654:   Called dyn_compile
 *   ebuild.sh, line 990:   Called qa_call 'src_compile'
 *   ebuild.sh, line 44:   Called src_compile
 *   zfs-fuse-0.4.0_beta1-r1.ebuild, line 35:   Called die
 *
 * Make failed


So it won't be simple, and I wonder if ramuk is correct, can these little CPUs handle a 128-bit file system?


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 10:00 pm 
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Joined: Tue Oct 23, 2007 2:26 pm
Posts: 9
Hmm, you want to try overiding the check? I suspect that it should work as the code is endian aware (thank you SPARC) and 128 bit addressing has to handled explicitly anyway. The defs for ARM are probably missing and need hacking. FUSE hasn't shown up much performance degradation with ZFS under x86 apparently. I suspect the limited memory of the Kuro's may be more of an issue than the CPU.

Oh, and I'm glad to hear that people here know what ZFS is, 'cause it's my favorite toy! :lol:

Not to start a flame war, but the only reason that you can't have a kernel native implementation of ZFS is the Linux camp's "GPL or Nothing" ideology. I don't like religious fanatics, whether it's killing in the name of a god or code. <shrug> GPL, BSD, CDDL, whatever, as long as the source is open.

James


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 10:44 pm 
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Joined: Sat Jul 15, 2006 8:49 am
Posts: 219
Location: Virginia
jgmdean2 wrote:
Hmm, you want to try overiding the check?

Of course that was my first inclination to start hacking it :D So I changed the function that was checking 'uname -m' to return 'i386' but more problems follow:
Code:
gmyth src # scons
scons: Reading SConscript files ...
scons: done reading SConscript files.
scons: Building targets ...
gcc -o cmd/zdb/ptrace.o -c -pipe -Wall -Werror -std=c99 -Wno-unused -Wno-missing-braces -Wno-parentheses -Wno-uninitialized -fno-strict-aliasing -D_GNU_SOURCE -D_FILE_OFFSET_BITS=64 -D_REENTRANT -DTEXT_DOMAIN="zfs-fuse" -ggdb -O2 -Ilib/libavl/include -Ilib/libnvpair/include -Ilib/libumem/include -Ilib/libzfscommon/include -Ilib/libzpool/include -Ilib/libsolcompat/include cmd/zdb/ptrace.c
In file included from lib/libsolcompat/include/sys/types.h:30,
                 from /usr/include/stdlib.h:438,
                 from cmd/zdb/ptrace.c:47:
lib/libsolcompat/include/sys/isa_defs.h:462:2: error: #error "ISA not supported"
scons: *** [cmd/zdb/ptrace.o] Error 1
scons: building terminated because of errors.

And so when I go in lib/libsolcompat/include/sys/isa_defs.h to see what I can do there, it's so many #if defined(foo) #elif defined(bar) to know what to do without some study.

Perhaps there are some people out there working on porting to other platforms.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 26, 2007 12:00 am 
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Joined: Tue Oct 23, 2007 2:26 pm
Posts: 9
If you have the time to futz with this, have you seen:

http://www.wizy.org/wiki/ZFS_on_FUSE

According to http://zfs-on-fuse.blogspot.com/

Quote:
At the moment, a new port of ZFS-FUSE to 32-bit PowerPC is being worked on, with the kind help of Thomas Riddle (Sun engineer) and Matt Sealey (Genesi manager) and his developers.


Did you get the overlay and instructions from here: http://www.wizy.org/wiki/ZFS_on_FUSE/Gentoo ?

The ZFS community website porting page http://www.opensolaris.org/os/community/zfs/porting/ has some notes on compiler flags.

James


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 26, 2007 6:45 am 
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Joined: Sat Jul 15, 2006 8:49 am
Posts: 219
Location: Virginia
Yes I followed those instructions for the overlay on gentoo. Then when it didn't work I went straight to the source.

I gather from this message: http://lists.freebsd.org/pipermail/freebsd-current/2007-April/070544.html that it's not just a matter of compiler flags, but that "needed atomic operations" need to be implemented on the platform. I don't think I have time to do that :wink: but if a package for ppc comes out I can surely try it while my test box is available.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 26, 2007 10:08 am 
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Joined: Tue Oct 23, 2007 2:26 pm
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Darn. I'm going to try and ping Thomas Riddle @ Sun to see what he's done. Question: how portable is something like this between PPC and ARM? Anyone want to share?

James


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